The FCAT (Florida Comprehensive Assessment Test) is a state mandated test that is administered to students in third through eleventh grade. Its purpose is to bring about success in learning. It is assumed that it will have that result because the standards of education have (supposedly) been raised. The FCAT focuses on mathematics, reading, science, and writing from the Sunshine State Standards (SSS) as well as norm-referenced tests (NRT) in reading and mathematics, which are used to measure each child’s performance against others his or her age at the national level.
Kenneth, Trinell and I (Kelly) do not feel that is actually accomplishing any of the goals that it was mandated to do.
(Primary Source: http://fcat.fldoe.org/)
The state of Florida requires third graders to pass the state mandated FCAT, or Florida Comprehensive Assessment Test. In the 3rd grade, the children must have higher than a level one in order to pass to the next grade. These children will fail that grade, regardless of their grades during the entire school year, if they do not pass the test. Also, it should be taken into consideration that some children do not test well.
In 2007, more than 33,000 students -- up from 6,000 students -- will have to repeat the 3rd grade. Although our former governor professed an idealized concept of “no child left behind,” many children were, literally, left behind when they did not successfully meet the requirements of FCAT. Congress should ensure that our children have every opportunity that they are entitled to in life. Not passing the FCAT will hinder them by having them adopt a stigma of "failure." (Kenneth Clayton)
(Source: http://www.npr.org/templates/story/story.php?storyId=1417313)
I do not believe that the FCAT is a "fair" test. There are children who take the test and are from a poorer demographic (such as migrant workers) or have a slight learning disability. They do not have the same advantages as those who are in stable, permanent homes or have the financial resources to receive extra help. Also, as Kenneth pointed out, there are children who simply do not test well. For those children, the pressure put upon them can be overwhelming, causing them to fail.
Additionally, since the test has become such an important part of the curriculum, it seems that educators only “teach for the test” and other subjects lose precedence. As a result, I feel that the FCAT does not prepare the student for the real world.
Schools also receive extra funding if their students pass the FCAT. Therein lies another problem. For example, if your child happens to be at a school whose students, as a whole, failed the test, he or she will have to suffer with limited resources and lower-skilled teachers. That causes a vicious cycle of failure. If a school is not given the financial resources to improve, usually they will never improve. (Kelly Slocum)
Source: http://www.fcarweb.org/
I believe the FCAT is biased against people who live in poor communities. Also, it is unfair that a student would have to pass the FCAT to graduate. Students today have a better chance passing the SAT or ACT. For many years, students have taken the SAT or ACT successfully and went on to college. I don’t understand why a student would have to pass the FCAT, when the SAT and ACT have been around for such a long time. It has not been proven that passing the FCAT makes the student any smarter than passing the SAT or ACT. Because of the FCAT, many students have failed or believe they would never graduate from college. In a July 24, 2006 Lakeland Ledger article about seniors setting an FCAT "failure record," it showed that in Polk County alone 418 seniors received a certificate of completion, which is given to students who don’t pass the FCAT. They represent 10.7 percent of district seniors. Superintendent Gail McKinzie said "more Polk high students may be failing because the district is not doing a good job teaching some of the items tested." (Trinell Webster)
Source: http://www.theledger.com/
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46 comments:
I agree with all -- the FCAT has become a living nightmare to Florida students, educators, and, yes, school administrators alike. The FCAT should simply be what it originally was designed as: an assessment as to what students may or may not have learned. In other words, it should measure learning gains and what needs to be incorporated into the curriculum. It should NOT be a system of rewards and punishments for our schools.
I honestly feel that the educational system in the united states, as a whole, is extremely poor. Children in other countries are so much more advanced than our children (and also more advanced than some of our adults). It is sad to see that our Government doesn't care. Instead of placing more tax money towards a better educational system, they decide to create the fcat. I feel that the major reason why the fcat was created was so that they would not have to invest the tax funds towards summer school assistance for our children, which was a lot more costly to them than having children take a test at the end of the year.
I also agree with everyone about the FCAT. I don’t’ think the students should be pressured to perform well on just one test. The school faculty takes the FCAT week so seriously and helping students to prepare so they will all score well on the test. They go as far as giving them nutritional breakfast from what I hear. The faculty should prepare all students like this all year round, not just when it is FCAT week. I also agree with the previous poster that our educational system is not very successful and we’re failing our kids. My husband is from Taiwan. We used to talk about the differences between my school here and his school in Taiwan. They are far more advanced. For ex. he had algebra in the 7th grade and I had it in the 9th grade. BUT they also are in school much longer than us. Elementary students are in school from 7am to 5pm. Jr high and high schools are in class from 7am to about 8pm depending on their academic scores. I find it fascinating that they are in school for the entire day and I used to complain about my school here.
Trinell’s quote of Superintendent Gail McKinzie talking about "not doing a good job of teaching what is tested" really struck a chord for me. My good friend, Kenneth “KB” Butler (currently in the Volusia County school system) has been teaching for nearly 35 years. Every year he gives his students what he fondly calls a “door knob” test to assess how poorly educated they are. A couple of the questions on the door knob test are: “What weighs more, a ton of feathers or a ton of bricks?” and “Is Stonehenge a temple or is it something to hold a door in place?” You would be shocked at some of the answers. One student answered the first example question with, “This is a trick question so it must be a ton of feathers.”
I have known KB since his first post as an educator in 1975 and we have talked about the FCAT a few times over the last few years. My opinion of FCAT is greatly influenced by KB’s views. Per KB, some subjects are being ignored because the FCAT is so important to funding in the schools. As noted in the blog, the higher a school’s FCAT scores are, the more funding the school receives. Children are being trained to be professional test takers, not in what one would call “real world” applications. Children are being trained to have the skills needed to learn the jobs of burger flipper and cashier.
Another example of the lack of education (in my opinion, due to the FCAT) comes to mind. Back in the 1990’s, I was working for a mobile photography company based here in Lakeland, FL and we hired a recent graduate of Mulberry High School. She was an intelligent young woman and was able to learn with ease. She caught on to all of the processes and procedures quickly and was able to work with a minimum of supervision. In conversation, however, I found that she thought the conflict in Vietnam was just a story and that she didn’t know where Washington, D.C. was located on the map of the United States that we kept posted on the wall in our War Room (the room where we laid out the schedules and routes for our photographers). I was shocked to see that this bright young lady was put into this situation by our education system. The situation of never being able to be much more than a clerk in a low paying, no benefits job is her destiny. Why are History and Geography not important enough to teach well? It is because of the focus on subjects tested by FCAT.
Also mentioned in the blog was that some individuals have a difficult time with testing albeit, those same individuals may be quite intelligent. In my workplace, when one applies to a more advanced position, standardized testing is required. I remember talking with one of my coworkers, who applied to a position similar to mine, and being told by her that she would break out into a cold sweat at the mention of the word test. Just the thought of testing made her very anxious and when the actual testing occurred, her mind was preoccupied. Of course this reflected negatively on her test scores (which, by the way, were good enough that she got the position).
As pointed out in the blog, there is a bias against those students from poor areas which brings me to the hypothesis that the tests are biased against individuals who do not speak Standard American English fluently. This includes people from poverty stricken areas where many people who speak another variant of English that isn’t recognized by the testing authorities such as Black – includes grammatical rules from ancestral languages, Redneck – seems to me to be most closely related to the grammatical rules of the Highland Scotts, and Heavily Accented – in enclaves of immigrants from all over the world. I remember as a child hearing on TV that if a typical White child were to be given a standardized test geared toward Black children raised in a city ghetto, the White child would fail miserably. For example, a sample definition question could be: Alley Apple a) a fruit b) a vegetable, c) a brick or d) a flower. The answer is c) a brick. This example may be dated, and that term no longer used, but it gets my point across.
In conclusion, I think that the FCAT is a big waste of time for everyone involved and an onus to the taxpayers who are funding all aspects of the testing. There are already standardized assessment tests in place (SAT and ACT) so the FCAT isn’t really needed. We need to keep subjects such as band, art, and physical education. Some schools have dropped these courses due to lack of funding caused by low FCAT scores. If the powers that be “need” the FCAT, they should use it more positively. Assess the child’s knowledge, tailor an educational program for that child (isn’t the guidance counselor supposed to be doing that anyway?) and give the child the training needed to thrive, not just to survive.
I think that the FCAT is a bunch of crap it took me three times to pass the reading part and i only found out my test scores one week before graduation sothat was really ruff on me. I think that the FCAT is just a test to rate the school and how there teaching skills are being rated.So if you ask me I say no to FCAT!
I honestly do not mind the F-CAT. Number one it was very easy and I passed it the first time, along with many others. I do not know why people have a hard time with it. Everything that you learn is on there. When i was in 10th grade, all we did was go over f-cat type questions up until the test. I HIGHLY DISAGREE with what SHIRLEY said about the educational system as a whole in the United States. My girlfriend lived in Texas for two years and went to Allen High School as a Freshman and Sophomore. They have a test called TACS (i believe)and it is virually the same as the F-CAT. Over 90 % of the students passed it both years she was there. This school was a little more strict than the schools here in Polk County. If guys had beards, they had to shave it. Maybe if schools were like the ones in Texas or other parts of the country, there wouldn't be such a problem. Overall, I do not think there is anything wrong with the educational systems or the F-CAT.
I guess I was fortunate enough where I did not have to take this FCAT test, because from the sounds of it this test seems to be a bitch. I know when I went through school we had the HSCT and if I remember right all it dealt with was reading and math. So if you were able to pass that you were fine to graduate pending that you passed all the rest of your classes. I kind of feel bad that they target third graders with this test. Arn't they a little to young to take a test with the result of holding them back even when they did well all year. That could also be an embarassment to them when they final get to graduate at the age of 20. This should just be an assement to assist teachers with what the child needs help on, not ruin their education experience.
When researching information for this blog, I found very little information that reflects any improvements made by this powerful test. In the response made by Travis, he says that is was easy for him and should also be for others. I disagree. As pointed out in our blog, socio-economic background plays a big part in how well those "other" children test. He also says that in 10th grade, he and his classmates did nothing but prepare for the test. That brings up another good point; while they are focusing on subjects primarily covered on the FCAT, they are leaving behind important subjects like history and science. In those subjects, there are many hands on activities that keep children interested in learning. When those subjects are sacrificed, many intelligent children begin fall short, simply because they are bored. And Travis, you are correct; your girlfriend is taking a similar test in Texas. All states now test this way, to be in accordance with George W's Elementary and Secondary Education Act, which is also known as "No Child Left Behind". Many other states are struggling with the same issues, because of the standardized tests that are put into place for this act. NCLB seems to do really well at reporting failure, but it falls short in improving those who fail.
Back in my day (ha!!) we has a test called the CTBS test that you took in the 3rd, 5th, & 10th grade. (If my memory is correct. At 32, I try not to remember too much.) There was no pass/fail grade. It measured where you were in relation to the rest of the country that also took the test. The only thing my school used it for was to place kids in a special class. This class was for “academically talented” children and it also took into account your classroom grades.
So let me get this straight….here in Florida (and maybe other states) you can bust your ass all year long studying and getting A’s & B’s but if you don’t pass the FCAT, you don’t pass. Are you serious?!?!?! Then the schools that score high get more money from the government than the schools that score lower. Doesn’t it make sense that the schools that score lower are the ones needing more money? And this state wonders why it can’t find or keep teachers. HELLO!!
I don’t have children but co-workers and friends that do say its complete bullshit. Some of their children do get stress because they know if they don’t pass they won’t advance and get left behind. Some of them have their children go to private school, where they don’t have to take the FCAT because they don’t receive government funding. So let me see…..if you have money, you can send you child to private school where the Florida Standards do not apply. What the hell?!?!? Are these schools not also in Florida? So then there is no “Florida Standards”. II fear having children because of the way the school system is.
Tasha, not only that, if students who fail the FCAT cannot move on to the next grade, this, logically, results in overcrowded classrooms -- yet another issue that's been brought up in the news quite frequently. It's a detrimental chain reaction.
Travis, it's interesting you brought up passing the FCAT. Do you think this test fairly assessed your academic skills, especially those skills necessary to move you onwards to the next grade...even into college?
I forgot to cite my source on the NCLB Act. That info came from TIME magazine. Vol. 169, No. 23. It is the June 4th (2007) issue. The story is on pages 34-41. It is a very interesting article.
Thank you, Kelly, for the source info!
Today in the Ledger...
http://theledger.com/apps/pbcs.dll/article?AID=/20070603/NEWS/706030392/1134
The Ledger has an active forum as well. Take a look.
The FCAT is not evil. Social promotion is. Standards are how the world gauges everything. They are why we see a Volvo as a more safe car than say a Chevy. Standardized testing gauges how much a person knows somepared to others around the same age. No one complained when students scored poorly on the SAT/ACT becasue they didn't call it failing. In reality they only failed entrance into higher education. Why? Becasue they were not academically ready for them. What does the FCAT say if you score low on it? That you are not ready for the next level of education. Social promotion in schools is making students less motivated to learn. They know that if they don't learn they can just wait and bemmoved up anyway. Failing is not a punishment for scoring poorly on the FCAT, it's a sign that you haven't learned enough to survive the next level. FCAT is like colleges. IF you don't pass ENC 1101, you dont go on to the class we are in, 1102. It makes sence. If you can't do easy things, you WON'T be able to do hard things (and yes by "easy things" I was implying the FCAT was easy). I was educated in Polk county, and anyone educated here knows that its not the best learning an indivual can get, but it didn't matter. I was motivated to do well. I CARED not only if I passed, but if I did well and learned the information. That's the difference... care and students will be fine. It is only lack of care and motivation that keeps students back. Sure it may be harder to teach these things to a third grader, but I knew that I had to learn the things taught in class to get good grades in the class in third grade. I also knew that a A was better the a B or C and so on. I guess I've been hardened by the high standard I've been held to all my life, but the most important thing I've learned is this... Suck it up, learn what you need to learn and you'll be fine.
Garrett, I'll pose the same question to you, as I did Travis simply because you two are representative of those who took it, passed it well and moved onwards:
Do you think the FCAT fairly assessed your academic skills, especially those skills necessary to move you onwards to the next grade...even into college?
Being a good "test-taker" is just as important as knowing the information you're being tested on. I understand the FCAT is controversial because of "why" it exists, but as far as "what" it is, i agree with it. If a child has learned and is actually educated, they should pass with flying colors, period. Yes the idea of it being an "all or nothing" test but can be overwhelming but i think that can be controlled. My little sister was absolutely spooked over FCAT and the only i said to her was, "this isn't a test designed for you to fail, it's to be sure those should, will. There is nothing on this test you don't know so just prove you know it". She did wonderfully; but i will say this, the semester grades should be taken into consideration with the FCAT. I mean, how fair is it to have a child with who's been stellar all year, be held back because of one series of tests...
I agree with all of what Garrett wrote. Personally, I never had to take the FCAT. I went to a private school in Polk County and it was not a requirement. However, I was given a stardardized test. I was actually required to take it every year and it would assess the same areas as the FCAT. It was called the Standford Achievement Tests. I think standarized tests are good it assess what children have been taught and what they still need to learn. This idea is the basis of FCAT. If the FCAT believes students at a certain age should meet certain standards and the child fails I think the child should be held back. I do not think a schools funding should be determined by the childrens performance because as pointed out the low scoring schools need the most funding. But without a standard test for children to take how else are teachers to know what the children need to be taught.
I understand that some children are not good test takes but I know if a child know the information despite being bad at taking tests they will pass. I look at my sister as an example. She is not a good standardized test taker. She does extrodinary in a classroom but when it comes to tests like SAT and ACT she did not do as well as expected. Knowing she was not good at test taking she pushed herself to learn more and learn more about the test. As result she did not do as well as she would have liked but she got accepted to college, has now graduated, and is off to Duke for grad school in the Fall of 08. If a child cares and is willing to work hard they will pass a standardized test. It may be difficult but it will prepare them for life. Life is not always easy.
I agree with this. Not all children learn the same way. The test is all one way so of course not all of the students will pass. They might have better results if they tested the childs learning styles and then gave them a test to fix their style. FCAT is holding back smart kids from moving forward in school.
I am still in high school, and I remember the FCAT. At Auburndale we had three groups of people; the sure to pass, the pass but just barely, and the sure to fail. FCAT is a really pointless test because it is really just made for the gonna pass barely on average people. The kids who are waisting their time with FCAT are being forced to lose valuable education time getting ready for it just so some teacher can get better pay. the kids who fail it fail because they have already excepted defeat and that is what they get, and I blame their lack of preparedness on past teachers who did poor, probably getting them ready for their 3rd grade FCAT. I just really hate the FCAT, they put me in a reading class my 10th grade year so I could get ready for the FCAT, I knew how to read, That makes me mad that they would waste my time like that. I think it would be a lot better if they just did away with the FCAT......
I agree with Shirley. I think that our school system have literally hit rock bottom. A for f cat it almost destroyed my senior year. I struggle with math and each year i was within 5 points of not passing and if i didnt pass this year i wouldnt graduate! I did end up passing but with all the seniors stressing about college they dont need the fcat to worry about too. I think that numerous amounts of kids struggle with test anxioty which makes the fcat a more scarier think than it already is!
To answer a question Ms. Jennings posed to a couple others- no, I don't believe the FCAT was a fair evaluation of what I had learned throughout the year, especially in high school. With some freshman in trigonometry and seniors in algebra I, and only algebra I required by state law to graduate, I don't see as how they can "fairly" put geometry and trig. problems on a test required to pass 9th grade! No, I never had a problem with the FCAT personally, but I had many friends in high school that had problems with it for that reason. I agree with standardized testing as a pulse point for the general student population, but not as the end all to an academic year. I definitely don't agree with it as a rewards/ punishment system for schools, because as many others pointed out, it is the schools that are struggling that need the most help!
FCAT is a dreaded time of year. I do not think it is an adequate test nor is it a reason to hold students back a grade. In addition to the unfair failing and neglect to consider every child, the anxiety the FCAT causes many students is simply unneeded and does not provide a decent test taking environment. This terror of a test takes time from the classroom by forcing teachers to cram FCAT specific information into their students in order to recieve a little extra funding. Fair or not, it does, however, assess the student's preformance as accurately as any standardized test can.
The FCAT is a tool used by the state to evaluate the students grade progression.Administrators need to have a guage to asses the education process .The problem I have, is with the education process.The FCAT is taken in February ,it should be given in May.This will give the students more time to prepare.Most public schools do not offer extra class to prepare for the FCAT.In Jamaica we have a similar evaluation process.However this test is at the end of the school year.There is a summer school and students who are behind in class are given an additional hour of tuition after school. Flordia needs to offer this to its schools.Also schools whose students do poorly on the FCAT should receive extra funding not less.
I did not read everybody's comments and I am not thoroughly informed about the FCAT but here are some of my thoughts... From many whom I've talked with about the school system in Florida, I have only heard negative thoughts about the FCAT, from parents, teachers, and administrators. Children develope and learn at different rates, and if a child earns c's or d's on report cards for a year or two they may turn it around the next year without having to repeat a grade. This big once a year test causes so much anxiety for students and teachers. I took care of a 3rd grade boy and most of his homework was geared towards being able to answer questions in test format. He always felt inferior to his brother who frequently scored above his grade level. That's not good. These kids are definately missing out on subjects that are not on this one test and that is very unfortunate. Even the arts and physical education have an incredible impact on a child's overall development and academic ability.
I took various achievement tests in Michigan during my school years, but they didn't count for anything individually until high school and then it was just for scholarships - - not pass or fail high school!!!
STOP THE FCAT!!!!!!!!!
I think that the FCAT is easy, but I don't think that it should be as big of a deal as it is. Some people are poor test takers. I graduated with a guy who always did well in school and just couldn't pass the FCAT so he never got his high school diploma. I don't think that is fair.
A number of people have remarked on those with a lack of test-taking skills or those who simply do not test well. What do you believe must be done, should the FCAT remain as is, to assist those who are susceptible to testing problems, such as test anxiety?
Remember, not everyone tests well.
I disagree that socio-economic effects students' learning and test taking ability. There was a homeless student who aced her way through high school (HS) and all the way to Harvard. (I saw it on OPRAH). She was homeless! I'm an example as well. I went into kindergarten at age 6 and didn't speak any English. By 7th grade I was in all honors classes and aced my way through HS. I was raised by a single mother with two other siblings. And she was making minimum wage at the time. Socio-economic didn't interfere or affected my learning at school. My mother spoke and still speaks broken English. She was not able to help me with homework. In fact, I often had to do my brother's homework because he had to work after school. And he was 5 grades ahead of me. So in this perspective, I agree with Garrett. Doing well in school was an understanding I grew up with. I was never told that I had to do well in school. I just knew it was my job to excel. How did I make it through 4 yrs of college? My hard work in HS afforded me many grants and scholarships to put me through college. My mom didn’t have to pay a penny for my college education.
We are all given the same opportunities and learning environment. There is really no excuse to fail or not do well in school unless you have mental problems/illnesses or other learning disabilities. Just my opinion……..
No I think that they should change the FCAT to make it more suitable to the students testing abilities whether they are high or low.
Khim, I believe you are right. In certain situations, children from poorer backgrounds do excel beyond their financial boundaries. I think it is wonderful you did so well. You are obviously a driven person. You are one who will continue to strive, even when obstacles are put in your way. I respect you for that. It is a valiant quality to possess. But that is not always the case for everyone. I think that it is rare (unfortunately) for those poorer children to do extremely well. I have found (especially in this county) that there are many parents, grandparents, etc. who still have the attitude of "It was good enough for me, so It's good enough for you" and those people continue to live the impoverished lives, which their family has lived for generations. I work at a "juice" plant, in administration. However, there are jobs, at the plant, that are very low on the pay scale. Those jobs also have work environments that most would consider awful. For the most part, the ones who work in those areas, that are not considered ideal (where the juice is made and bottled), are of that mindset. It is very hard to change the way they think. So, unless their children have amazing teachers (which they don't because those teachers are usually at the better schools...in better areas), they will probably end up the same way. It is a sad, but common fact.
I think my point is being missed. Standardized testing is not a bad thing, when it used to evaluate a child’s education level which is then compared to others their age, etc. I think the problem arises when the funding and resources are taken away from the “failing” school and given to the school that is already doing well. It obviously creates a cycle of failure.
I have read all of the entries in this discussion. Some I agree with and some I don't. There should be a standardized test, like the FCAT. However, the way it is designed it wrong. I would suggest that a part of the test be taught, and then tested. This way the students retain the information. If the information is taught throughout the year, and then the test is given once toward the end of the school year, then most of the information is forgotten.
Also, people are different when it comes to learning. Some retain information better than others. There are no absolutes when it comes to the human mind. You can be dirt poor and still be smart, or rich and dumb as a box of rocks. Having said that I do believe that a person(s) social economic status plays a role on their ability to learn. If a person goes to school worrying about where their next meal with come from, or if they will have somewhere to lay their heads, then of course their grades will suffer.
Furthermore, if you check the stats most of the failing schools are in the impoverish schools. Then they put magnet schools in these neighborhoods, where very few of under privileged students qualify to attend.
The final point I would like to make is just make the test fair. Also, test as the subject is learn, not many months later.
I'll echo your remarks, Kelly. Certainly, there are individuals who can overcome horrendous obstacles and surmount the odds that face them even under such dire conditions as poverty. However, it's not common.
Also, what of those suffering from malnourishment? How can we realistically expect students from poverty-stricken households to perform well on a test (never mind general coursework) when they've not eaten a proper meal, ever?
Yes, I do feel that the FCAT did well in assessing my academic skills. In high school I took many "honors" classes, so I didn't know exactly what the level of a normal student was, but unless it was far below what I was held to, the FCAT was a fair test to see if we could advance. As far as a test for college entrance goes, the FCAT was not up to that standard, but that's what the SAT and ACT were for. Given had I failed, I might not have felt the same about the FCAT, but I would have had to have performed well below my academic level to have failed.
I don't know if there is tutoring out there for FCAT or not but I think that if the state is going to give the test they should pay to teach students how to prepare for the test and know exactly the kind of stuff that is going to be on it. When I took the FCAT, I don't remember any preparation except that the school made us read a lot!
Ms. Jennings, I think the FCAT is just one of the reasons for school overcrowding but maybe it would help to not use this test to "pass" a student onto another level.
I know that the SAT has been mentioned. You only take the SAT if you WANT to go to college. You can even take it as many times as you want and the schools will only see the best score which is ludicrous. You don’t like your score the first time, take it again until you do. With the FCAT you NEED to be pass to move on. You don’t really have a choice “oh do I want to go on to the 4th grade?” You HAVE to. You don’t like your score the first time, sorry about your luck ‘cause you’re going to repeat the grade. I don’t see how the two can be compared.
Cassie, I don’t think they have tutoring for the FCAT at least not that I’ve heard anyone mention. And if they did you’d probably have to pay a stupid amount for it.
There is tutoring available for the FCAT with various non-profit orgs around the state. Locally, the Learning Resource Center offers tutoring for ANY particular type of test (including the FCAT).
I have a question to Shirley. When you state the the US has a poor educational system, what is your reasoning? I am not disagreeing wholly with your statement, just that the evidence you present is not necessarily supportive of your statement. For example, did you know that European (and many Asian) nations track their students. For example, everyone receives the same education until, say the 8th grade (or equivalent) at this time students are tested and either put into vocational training or academic. The testing scores of these nations, specifically England, France, Germany, and Japan only publish the scores of the academic track. Therefore, when one compares the test scores of these countries to those of the US, we have a disparity in data. It is comparing apples to oranges in that the US educates EVERYONE, not just those in the academic track.
Now I agree that testing is not the best way to improve our educational system. As a teacher in the public schools systems, I abhor standardized testing. We have to remember the people making these laws are not educators rather politicians. I am just suggesting that when you state reasons, you may want to check the validity of the evidence you present.
Good point, Jaqui. That goes for anyone who offers an assumption (remember that's one element of a good argument, but you need all three...). Offer support as that lends credence to your argument.
There is only so much people can do for those with test anxiety. Solitary rooms, extra breaks, but at some point the once disadvantaged have the upper hand. The kids in the stuffy classrooms wishing that the cold and flu season would give them some peace and quiet would not mind, im sure, the isolated testing areas.
As for the malnourished, one good meal in the begining of the FCAT period will do little good in turning the tables on what could be a month, a year, a lifetime of malnourishment. If the school system cared that much (which in most cases they do) they will provide food in the mornings. There is a system in place for students to recieve free food.
The high school I attended had classes for the students who did not pass the FCAT to take in order to improve their FCAT skills. I still do not believe that this test should determine the students' graduation. Wasn't that what taking classes was supposed to decide?
Yes, Susan, schools do provide food (and, certainly, there are benefits for those who cannot afford food), but is it food with any semblance of nutritional value?
Supposedly the school food is healthy and well balanced. Some of the meals taste awful, but lunch is a nutritional meal complete with meat, veggies, and milk.
I have not experienced the breakfast food as much as lunch, however the schools can (and probably do) provide a nutritional breakfast. The schools do try to keep the kids healthy, some kids may choose not to eat the full meal or are too proud to accept the food, but I do not doubt the nutritional value of the school food, merely the taste.
Jaqui,
The reason why I say that the educational system is poor is because I have actually attended school in another country and the educational system was a lot more advanced there than it is here. this not the only reason why I made such a statement. If you look at the statistics of China you will see that they are also much more advanced than the United States. Their children go to school for 12 hours a day. I would comment further but my time is very limited. If you want proof I will have to get back to you on this.
Shirley is right that students in other countries such as Asia are in school a lot longer compare to students here. It is like a full-time job there for the students. As I stated earlier, they are in school from 7a.m. to about 5 p.m. or even 8 p.m. depending on their academics. Also, Jaqui is right that after a certain grade..say before going into high school, they take an exam that will determine their future basically. Those that score well will go to the universities and those that didn’t score well will be in vocational schools. (Or the wealthy sends their children to universities in the United States.) I’ll use my husband as an example. He wanted to go to med school. His exam score was not high enough to get into med school but high enough to get into vet school. I also know that the Scandinavian students are in the same boat as the Asian students. (I was a high school exchange student to Norway.) At that time I remembered my host sister was just accepted to a university, all paid for, she can study whatever she wanted. This was her reward for doing well in school all those years.
Perhaps, people who are in charge of the educational systems here will benefit from studying other countries’ school systems. It may be worth a try to implement some of their standards of testing instead of the FCAT.
Oops, I need to clarify this part: “…say before going into high school, they take an exam that will determine their future basically. Those that score well will go to the universities and those that didn’t score well will be in vocational schools.”
I mean they take an exam after Jr. High to determine which high school they will attend. Those that score well go to the better schools. After high school they take another exam to determine which career field they can study. Those that score well go to med school or the like and those that didn’t eill go to vocational or other fields that are not as tough as med school. I hope that makes sense.
Susan, I whole heartily agree with your comment regarding the fact that the test should not be used in determining the graduation status of a student. Here’s another think to look at…..if teachers are supposedly teaching for the FCAT and a student does well in classroom study but doesn’t do well on the FCAT, doesn’t that show there’s an issue somewhere? (I say supposedly because #1 I am not in their classrooms and #2 do not have any children so it is not a put down.) Just because someone is book smart doesn’t necessarily mean they can survive in the world.
In my opinion, it is not the FCAT teaching that pepares students for the "real world", but the classroom study. Teachers really only dedicate maybe a month to teaching students how to take the FCAT and what to expect. The answers to the FCAT questions are what the students learn in their everyday classroom settings. There are so many issues students can have with standerdized tests. Some have test anxiety, some have adhd, some have cheated their way through school and thus deprived themselves of the education they need to thrive.
Should the students who deprive themselves the education they need be deprived of a diploma as well? Should the students who have problems with taking tests be punished along with the students who will suffer later in life?
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